A "Do Not Fade" Option

On behalf of someone else: Because the Deck starts (button or remote) are disabled during Auto, it is usually necessary to start a song under a sweeper/dry jingle. Using the “Next” button isn’t an option, as the jingle would fade out as the song started… Therefore, would it be possible for the Properties window to offer a “Do Not Fade” tickbox - So that if “Next” is pressed, the item continues playing until the end-cue ?

I did suggest that the auto/manual mode be toggled, so that the presenter can “take control” - but the idea being that the commonly used button on the keyboard is the big green one called “NEXT” :wink:

You can sort of ‘fake it’ by specifying a very long Fade Duration in the Properties of the sweeper, but it depends on the relative levels.

Ideally, yes, it would be handy to have a standard Property of ‘play item to EOF without fading’—or something like that!

BFN
CAD

In the current situation, it’s not too easy to implement. The algorithm goes like this:

  • When you press NEXT, any currently playing player is faded.
  • Then a worker function is called which checks if there is any “on air” player at the moment. If not (because the previous player is fading), it will determine the next player and start it.

This function is used in various other conditions, for example when you add songs during automation. It ensures that the automation is playing when it is supposed to, and that the players are loaded and unloaded as needed.

Soon, I will need to change the algorithm anyway when introducing the “start next” cue markers (start the next item without fading). I will keep your suggestion in mind, it will be a lot easier to implement then, as it’s the same idea as “start next”, only that it’s called manually.

Torben

Could you please explain ‘start next’ a bit more, Torben?

It sounds like you are talking about a new, additional type of Cue point: is that right? If that is correct, it may not be the answer for every occasion.

For something like a sweeper ident/jingle, then yes, you will probably want to add a Start Next point to the MMD so that it happens automatically every time. But sometimes, you will want to run the sweeper without starting the next track ‘under’ it. So you would have to remember to remove the Start Next point from that one item in the Playlist: correct? I don’t think our presenters could be relied on to do that. :frowning:

Please remember that some of us DO NOT run everything from a Playlist (especially not jingles and sweepers!), and we rarely have MLP Playlist files for shows set up in advance like a military operation. We only ever have live presenters (no voicetracking, ever) who much prefer to use the Cartwall to run sweepers etc. In our setup, the Cartwall uses a separate output from the ‘music’ Playlist Players, so we can manually mix between them on the desk.

The point of mentioning this is that I would like to know what happens if you set a Start Next point for an item, then put that item into a Cartwall Player? If Cartwall Players ‘ignore’ Start Next, then no problem; otherwise, problem!

PS: The Cartwall is MUCH MORE important to us than automation! We almost never automate the main Playlist (except occasionally for a ‘toilet break!’).

BFN
CAD

OK Torben, that sounds fair enough.

Thanks.

In the current situation, it's not too easy to implement. The algorithm goes like this:
  • When you press NEXT, any currently playing player is faded.
  • Then a worker function is called which checks if there is any “on air” player at the moment. If not (because the previous player is fading), it will determine the next player and start it.

This function is used in various other conditions, for example when you add songs during automation. It ensures that the automation is playing when it is supposed to, and that the players are loaded and unloaded as needed.

Soon, I will need to change the algorithm anyway when introducing the “start next” cue markers (start the next item without fading). I will keep your suggestion in mind, it will be a lot easier to implement then, as it’s the same idea as “start next”, only that it’s called manually.

Torben

This is geting very close to the voice tracking scenario (nasty word, I realise) and it behoves me to ask that when this “start next” event cue marker is invoked, that there is an option to put in a smooth ducking /level changing scenario whereby if a cold voice track is superimposed over the outgoing currently playing track it can be set to duck/fade to “n” db.

I realise this is going to open up a whole new can of worms :slight_smile:

I’ve just been reading Torben’s post regarding the level ducking, and now this re: Start Next Cue point… I think this may give everybody some headaches, I think it really depends on how you “prefer” to automate.

A “start next item without fading current” marker would be good, although if all the dry bits at then end of your musical jingles have these markers (in DPS, it’s called a “dropstart” marker), you will have them possibly drowned-out by the song starting - You’d need an operator there to ride the faders - 'cos mAirList doesn’t do ducking (of the simple kind!). Going back to DPS - during auto, it has reserved categories (like: DRY, ID, TRACKED) and knows when it needs to duck an item to make room for a sweeper/dry ID. In mAirList, this is going to be difficult (at present).

We also have the problem of a StartNext marker being too far back from the end of a sweeper - If the marker is -10s from the end, and the song intro is 8s - Will we get a 2s crash of the vocals or will mAirList never allow markers to overlap - and thus cause a crash of the vocals…? Other rules like “don’t overlap if no intro set” - stuff like that would help.

Sorry for the ramble, hopefully I’ve outlined some issues and provided new ways of Torben being glued to his PC…