V5.0 issues and thoughts

Briefly tested 5.0
I installed with an import of the v4.4 settings.

Some things:

Cartwal: only one audio output?
I work with 4 faders and 4 stereo outputs for the carts, seems no longer to work. (could not configure it)

Loop points:
Would be nice to play-enter/exit loops on remote command.
Not only for the cartwal but also for the players.

Just some things that catched my eye here.



What is the story on the single output device for the cartwall?
Imho I think this is a big step back :’(

Distinct audio devices will come back. It was remarked by Timo (who did some pre-beta tests for me) already.

It’s more complicated than on the old cartwall - just imagine what happens when you drag the item around between slots (with a different device), it must change the device instantly.

Most people use a single device though.

Commands for exiting loop: Good idea. Will implement this.

For the normal players, you can simply use “PLAYER 1-1 OPTION LoopMode OFF” to turn off the loop button and make the player exit the loop.


The price I have to pay for using a large console 8)
Just like to minimize the use of a mouse.
I like all the new options though :slight_smile:

I will wait for further updates.

Per-player audio config is back in the new build 2503. Can you give it a try?

It should even be possible to change the config at runtime (unless old device is DirectSound hardware mixing and new device is not, or vice versa). Try moving an active cart around from one spot to another, it should change its device instantly :slight_smile:

Seems to work :slight_smile:

Only thing what’s not working is the individual per cart PFL (Cartwall X PFL On)


The remote start is not always working and some carts loose their given playback device

Individual PFL per player is no longer supported, it’s all or nothing :slight_smile:

But it should be easy to add remote commands to open/close the Cue Editor PFL for an item. So you have the PFL function back.

Audio devices working again (turned numbering back on)

The rest is confusing…

My basic setup here:
Fader assignment:

PLayer1 Player2 Cart1 Cart2 Cart3 Cart4

All these have fader and button start and a pfl (Cue)button
So why isn’t it possible to use the cue per (Cart) anymore? I want to be able to hear what’s under a fader with one push on the button and no mouse clicks.

Hope you can add it because for me V5 is a No Go this way :frowning:

It will be possible to link the PFL command I mentioned to a remote start, of course.

It think the problem is that you are using the cartwall in a quite unusual way. Most people have many cart players, but only a single audio output for the entire cartwall. That’s the way the cartwall (also the old one) was designed.

The new cartwall is a bit of a paradigm shift, because it moves away from the “fixed players” approach to a “work area” approach with a grid onto which you can position the audio items freely. They appear to be players when you look at them, but actually it just items “floating around” on the work area, with x/y position and a particular width/height, and a dynamically assigned number based on the setting in the “Numbering” menu.

I think it is possible to emulate the behavior of the old cartwall in this new framework, but still, it is not the way the cartwall was designed.

Your approach with the individual players and faders makes me think we should have something similar to the playlist players, just without a (visible) playlist. Let’s call it “indepedent players” that you load/close manually, and which don’t get their context from any playlist.

I do know Torben, only I am not as “most” people :stuck_out_tongue:
And yes, I would like to see some independed players like they where in 4.4
This way I can play with SFX, Beds and so on… leaving me the “real” cartwall on one dedicated fader.

The PFL works but I have to do 2 actions now instead of one.
Now I must hit the PFL on the console and then the Start button.
So really would be happy when I can “remotely” hit PFL, the cue editor comes up and starts playing

Ah well, I will hang on tight and wait.

Thanks for the great work!

I also use the Cartwall with three separate players on their own mixer channel.

That was the big difference to all the other (mostly free) programs which are working after the touchscreen monitor principle "click and play”.

I use the Cartsets just as a big library and have the elements to play-out getting drawn into a normal player with accompanying playlist.

The respective Playlist served me almost as a “stack” of the Cartplayer, which you could also remove within a custom layout.

I think Torben understood the fundamentally different way of working and hopefully we can next to the Onair/OffAir/PFL in click&play mode even introduce a “player mode” which works on the previous Click&Move/Load principle.

Just an idea …

I have thought about the “independent player” approach, and apparently it’s not so difficult. andi711 got the point already There’s merely two things I have to take care about:

  1. The playlist should be invisible on the screen - pretty easy to achieve with a custom layout (set width/height to 0), but it should also be possible to hide in in auto layout mode.

  2. mAirList must automatically clean up the playlist, in particular: remove items that are not loaded into any player. So you don’t end up with tons of garbage items in the invisible playlist.

It’s still important to note that these “independent players” are not a cartwall: There is no cart sets, there are no triggers, … But if you can live with that, it’s a nice replacement, isn’t it?

I can add experimental support for this in one of the next builds if you like.

Love to try that :slight_smile:

Will wait for a new build.

I only have part #2 (automatic cleanup) finished by now - don’t know if I have time for part #1 (invisible playlist) before leaving for holidays. Are you using a custom layout? If so you can just use the layout designer to hide the playlist. Although in the beginning it will be convenient to see what’s going on, if the cleanup algorithm works fine.

Working with custom layout yes.

Take your time and enjoy the holliday

I also work with a custom layout, but if you invisible the playlist sometimes please make this also as a configurable option!
I always like to see what’s going on each Player and have arranged my layout accordingly.

So for me part #2 would be perfectly adequate :wink:

… Relaxing Holidays …

Maybe an idea…
It seems some people liked the old style cart players more than the new interface.

Maybe the use of both could work. In the configurator you then could activate the one you like most or even both:
Make two sections ‘Cartplayers’ (for the old style) and ‘Cartwall’ (for the new layout).
You can then enable one or both as you like.

I have considered that, but decided against it. It would have led to endless overhead, if-then-else-blocks all over, redudant command sets, … The goal was to replace the cartwall with a simpler but yet more powerful solution. Not to provide an alternative.

And sometimes you have to say goodbye to old stuff in order to discover the beauty of new things :slight_smile:

I was aware that some people will not like the new concept, or find things that worked better in the old cartwall. I really rely on the user feedback here, so I appreciate any hints or comments, and we’ll see what we can do. This is only v5.0, there will be v5.1, v5.2, … coming. But “bring back the old cartwall” is not really an option :wink:

Here’s an experimental version (based on the current v5 snapshot) that has the new “independent player mode” option under Playlist -> Options:


The invisibiliy option is not implemented yet. Leave the playlist visible, or hide it in your layout.

I’ll be away for a while now, so let’s discuss the further options when I’m back in August.